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Freedom_User

So...Your view is that everyone who goes to his church is a cesspool filled with racists?

 

SacredJellybean

The two are incomparable. Wright isn't saying that white people are an inferior race and preaching hate against them. The worst he seemed to express from that clip was the sentiment that white people are keeping black people disadvantaged. A little racist? Maybe, but to compare him to a black version of the KKK is ridiculous.

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Also,

I read Wright's other controversial comments, and the most racist one is that he says that Hilary has an advantage over Obama for being white. And after recent comments by Ferraro of Clinton's campaign bringing race to the light, he stated that he's tired of racial issues being brought to the forefront. I think one of his greatest advantages as a black candidate is precisely that he isn't trying to focus on race. No, I don't think your suspicions of Obama's racism hold water.

__________________
"Every age has its peculiar folly and if Charles Mackay, the author of the 19th century classic, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds were alive today he would surely see 'cannabinophobia' as a popular delusion along with the 'tulipmania' and 'witch hunts' of earlier ages. ... I also believe that future historians will look at this epoch and recognize it as another instance of the 'madness of crowds.'"
~Dr. Lester Grinspoon

Viper420

He does have to answer his critics because , like it or not, this man (by Obamas own words) has played an important role in shaping his character. What part of the racist comments from Reverend Hate did Obama embrace? How can he lead a nation of white people if he has an ounce of hatred towards that group?
BTW...where can I buy a set of blinders. The ones you're wearing seem to work quite well.

troublemaker_42

So, its OK if we elect a leader who recieves his spiritual guidence from someone who is "a little racist?" (also, how can one be a "little racist?" Either you beliefve your race to be superior or you don't, orat the very least, you have to believe a race is someone inferior to your own....racvism is usually pretty clearcut....a "little racist" doesn't really exist in most contenxts) Can you imagine the outcry from people like Farrakahn or Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson is it was found that McCain's preacher was just a "little racist" towards people of color? Can you imagine the damage his credibility would take if it was discovered he attrended a church where sermons were conducted about how the afro American race was responsible for the problems of the US, or that the US government created AIDS as a way to kill off the undesirables? What if McCain attended a church where the Rev. consistently repeated the prthase "God Damn America" and what is McCain's spireitual adviser traveled to Libya, with Farrakahn, who has repeatedly insisted theat the Jews are singlehandedly responsible for the wickedness of this world? HOW ON EARTH is this any different? Last I checked, blaming people of a certain race for a nation's problems was racism, without much disguise whatsoever. The only difference is that White people are so conditioned to be afraid of being labeled a racist, mst are afraid to publically say so. I personally beliueve this article sums things up better than I could myself


Racism and Prejudice-The Double Standard in Black Community by Sherwood M. — friends, george bush, veto | Gather
More or less, when I read it, it simply calls attention to one fact...Would Obama be treated differently in this situation had he been born with lighter skin? I believe the answer is yes. Obama, like it or not, is treated differntly because of his skin color. Isn't that the very defintion of racism? being treated differently or held to naother standard because opn the color of one's skin? In this case, however, Obama is embracing the way he is treated differntly, and trying to spin his subtle racism into a positive for his campaign. I'm not trying to be a racist myself, but what if Mc Cain attended a church extolling "White" values?

From the article, and the central point, as far as I'm concerned

wiki on Rev. Jermimiah Wright
Jeremiah Wright - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

__________________
Thomas Jefferson said, "No free man shall be debarred the use of arms."
Patrick Henry said, "The great object is, that every man be armed."
Thomas Paine noted, "Arms discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property."
Samuel Adams warned that: "The said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms."
John Steinbeck said "I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy" "When seconds count, the cops are just minutes away" www.sportsmenforobama.org

SacredJellybean

I picked up those blinders at that tin-foil hat shop you recommended. Thanks, dude, I'm all strapped in and ready to go!

And if this is the worst his critics can do, again, not impressed. Even if I didn't like Obama, this would still seem weak.

 

troublemaker_42

A President with strong ties (uintil the controvesey, of course) with a militant, racist Revereand....no, nothing to worry about at all there

troublemaker_42

I wouldn't attend a churh for 20 years and refer to its leader as "Almost like an Uncle" if I disagreed with what the underlying message was, and they way it was promoted. If the KKK held weekly meetings, would you, as a non-racist, attend for 30 years just because you like dthe fellowhip but disagreed with the ideas being promoted? "I'm not a drunk, I just go to the bar because I like to drink all day"

SacredJellybean

The racism thing is a sticky issue, but I'll try to give you the most objective response as I can. As a minority who was enslaved by us in the past, I feel that African-Americans are entitled to their grievances, even if I disagree with the more radical ones. I want the human race to look past skin color, something entirely irrelevant to what really matters (character), but I understand that it takes a long time. We're making great strides, I think, but obviously, there still exists racism towards African Americans. I don't blame the white man for all their problems, but if some of them want to believe that, it's their choice. I don't think that Obama believes that. Do all of you really believe that Obama is incapable of taking the good part of what Wright is preaching and applying it to his life? Does he have to completely and entirely agree with Wright on everything? I find it commendable that he's trying to distance himself from any race cards, but if you guys want to drag it into the arena, it's cool.

That article is long and I have things to do, but I promise to come back and give it a read at some point. In the mean time, do I believe that Obama would be treated differently were he a white man? Of course. Like it or not, being a white male puts you at a greater advantage than being a woman or a minority. Do I think he'd be just as popular? Most likely, perhaps even more. The man is respected so much because he is a great speaker, he's been more consistent with his (admittedly short) positions and voting record than Hilary or McCain, and he's calling for a change from the old, dirty politics. People loved Kennedy, people loved Clinton, and now people have a new young celebrity who delivers inspiring speeches.

You're right, hate speech is hate speech, no matter who it comes from. But I feel more repulsion from White Power beliefs than I do from radical black beliefs. Anyone who hates anyone else for the color of their skin is very wrong. But the fact is, if you're part of a majority and are advantaged as a result, you have less room to complain than those in a minority who have experienced actual racism. THAT'S the difference.

I haven't read Wright's wiki page yet either, but I'll take a look at it. I'm sure I won't agree with everything he says, but if I find that he is so racist that what he says disgusts me as much as Fred Phelps does, I will concede. From what I gather of what you said, it sounds like he believes AIDS was used to kill black people? That and the drug issue are the worst things he's said (I concede that I'm modifying something I said earlier, that the Hilary bit was the worst), and I think that's insanity. I doubt Obama believes either of those, but if you feel you can prove it more solidly, feel free.

SacredJellybean

Do you go to church yourself? How are your friends' relationships with their priests? I know if I believed in a certain religion, I would attend services even if I didn't agree with the preacher on every single point of his. Strong ties?

I guess you believe he's only saying that for political opportunism?

troublemaker_42

I have attended church in the past, and if I found that the individual supposedly giving me my spritual guidence was reading as much from "The Black Power handbook" (hyporthetical example) as he was the Bible, damn right I'd be switching churches. If my past church in rural SD started blaming other races for things not going in the direction the churtch wished, again, I'd switch churches. Black White, Yellow, Green.....I don't give a damn. If you are promoting messages of racial inequiality and hate, you have no businesss calling yourself a man of God. The race card is played out. If you are still blamiong the color of your skin for your current position in life, something is wrong. Theres far too many leaders of color to claim White America is the devil thats destroying you. Room to complain? Not anymore..... Slavery is over, and while its scars are still there, using the precieved hate as a method of promoting your own messages is irrepsonsible, and quite frankly, played out. I can openly be responsible for my own actions. I refuse to carry the sins of my anscestors, and I refuse to allow others to point their finger as me as the enemy when I had niothing nothing to do with what they are angry about. Slavery was an aweful blight on our nation's history,but that doesn't give everyone of color to rehash it and use it as an example of current opporession whewnever its convienient. I hate it as bad as I hate Nazi comparisons. To me, its an argument of last resort, somehting people fall back on when logic has failed.
Obama was pretty cozy with a leader who spit hate towards White America generally as a whole. Obama never distanced himself from this person until it threatened his political career. What kind of man attends the same church for 20 years, calling the reverand of said church "like and uncle" yet abandons him as soon as it affects him politically? Who abandoms people they were alleged close with because it might hurt their imagine? If he's willing to part ties with someone who was previously so important, what does that say about his integrity?