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oneluv4boognish

You're right...and that's the sickest and scariest thought of them all. I just can't imagine, as a mother, having a kid that did that...so twisted!

 

TheNewGuy

Umm, no. See, your environment is what makes you what you are, in combination with your genetic potentialities. In other words, unless you are acutally mentally ill because of a genetic deficiency, you are the same as everyone else in your area. You become what you are through interaction with friends, family, authority, etc etc. Except for people who are mentally ill (a person with a tendency to violence because of a chemical deficiency for example), nobody just comes out of the womb with an intent to murder other people. This kid must have had friends who were dealing, or a parent who was dealing, or maybe he was beat as a child, I don't know, but he didn't just come out of his mom holding a cell phone and a bag of heroin.

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"Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~P.J. O'Rourke

Buzzby

I'm afraid Killer is right: some people are born without an ability to care about how their actions affect other people. There are "bad seeds". That's not to say that this 13-year-old is one of them. Statistically it's much more likely that he was just following the American Dream: "Mo' Money".

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TheNewGuy

Really? Man, I didn't think I'd be proven wrong that easily. If you say thats the way things are, you must be right.

But seriously, I'd like to ask you what study you read that proved that "bad seeds" exist. Was it the latest American Journal of Psychiatry that showed how some people are just "bad"? I can't think of a scientific way in which you would prove that. I have seen evidence that a person's sourroundings can directly influence behavior, and that all things a person seesand experiences in thier life effects thier personality. Something happened at some point in this kid's life to influence how likely he was to get involved in drug dealing, or crime in general.

Like I said, these "bad seeds" must have an actual mental problem which makes them predisposed to becoming violent, otherwise they are as likely to be influenced by thier sorroundings in a negetive way as you or I.

Buzzby

They would have "an actual mental problem" whether it was congenital or influenced by environmental factors. It's called "antisocial personality disorder". It seems that people raised in entirely normal environments with completely normal siblings of similar ages can have it from a very early age.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSM-IV Antisocial personality disorder (APD) is a personality disorder which is often characterised by antisocial and impulsive behaviour. APD is generally (if controversially) considered to be the same as, or similar to, the disorder that was previously known as psychopathic or sociopathic personality disorder. Approximately 3% of men and 1% of women have some form of antisocial personality disorder.

 

TheNewGuy

Any disorder can in some way be treated, therefore there are no "lost causes" unless the person is so insane that locking them in an asylum is the only thing you can do to keep them from harming themselves or others. Antisocial Personality Disorder is something that can be treated with therapy, or if completely necessary, medication. So I still wouldn't write someone off as simply being a "bad apple" or something like that. This kids environment still influenced him, because if his parents had taken measures to have his condition treated he may have turned out differently.

killer12382

You could say that the prisons are filled with people who are mentally ill. Is it normal to steal? Is it normal to murder someone for whatever reason? Is it normal commit fraud or rape? You could say that all prisoners are in one form or another, mentally ill. Being Bad is a form of mental illness. Are these people born with it? Maybe. Does their environment bring it to the surface? Maybe. Am I happy that they are locked up? OH YES!!!!!!!

nacrypt

Only if you take a very simplistic view of things.

Also, I there probably are some people in jail who are actually innocent. The probability of the current U.S. justice system not making a single wrong conviction is very, very low. If you watch "Law & Order", a fictional but accurate drama, you'll see that in several instances innocent people are almost convicted.

Legalizing marijuana will be the key to improving the justice system as a whole. But the police/judges are against it because: 1. it makes them look like asshats for all the potheads they've busted, 2. cuts into their revenue stream.

Buzzby

Whoa! We were speaking in the abstract about the possibility that the kid had a mental disorder. There is really no reason to believe that this kid suffers from any kind of mental illness. You've got him diagnosed and in treatment!

If antisocial personality disorder is congenital, as it seems to be in some cases, it would not be treatable. Some structure that allows normal people to feel for others is missing. The best you could do is teach them to pretend to care about other people, which is how many sociopaths/psychopaths/APDs get back on the street after being locked up for some crime they've committed.

killer12382

And thats the scary part....they are just pretending. Lord, help us when they stop pretending.

Now knowing that they are pretending, is it right to put them back in society as a potiential predator? There's talk about keeping sexual predators behind bars after they complete their sentence as they can never be cured, should extend this idea towards all sociopaths?