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Buzzby

I was thinking of the Rastafarians.

Unfortunately, far too many medical marijuana users fall into that category, one of the reasons that the whole movement is in trouble.

Sincerity is a very difficult thing to measure objectively. That's why medical marijuana requires a physician's recommendation. Similarly, the government doesn't care if an individual is sincere about the spiritual aspect of their marijuana use. They would have to belong to a recognized religion with a history of the sacramental use of marijuana for their claims to be considered.

I have a schizophrenic friend who has a sincere belief that he's the rightful king of the British Empire. Do you think they should give him the crown?

So if a recently minted religion considered eating babies a sacrament, the members should be allowed to do it?

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Logos

Is it just me or is this site buggy? I can't seem to get the multi quote button to do anything, and whenever I give rep, I have to hit the button twice and have it tell me I can't give rep to the same post twice or it just sits there... I can't imagine mozilla being the issue, anyone else having issues with the site? PM me so as to not draw this off topic please.

Sorry, frustration set in for a sec, sorry I'm not going to quote your response Buzzby, I'm just going to respond.

I appreciate your answers, and comments, but I'm curious about a couple things.

It seems to me the sincerity issue would be in effect with Rastafarian's as well, it seems as if people could chose that religion simply to get high, and not because they are sincere. Also, if it is okay for Rastafarian's, how come no one else? A long time ago, before prohibition of cannabis was even an issue, a person by the name of Sula Bennet (I probably spelled that wrong) came to the conclusion that the word translated into calamus in the bible probably referred to cannabis, if that is the case, Christ was anointed with this oil, as were the priests of the day. I have even heard that the baptizing in water was to cleanse one of the effects of the oil. If that is the case, could a case be made for the Christian use? Or is it strictly limited to the Rastafarian faith? If the government is recognizing their use as the 9th circuit has done in the past, why not for any other religions who chose to make it their sacrament when they have scripture backing it up? I don't claim Christianity for this reason, I truly believe Christ's teachings, and try my best to abide by them. Cannabis helped me greatly in this regard. To be honest, its use makes it a lot easier for me to be more "Christ like" in my opinion.

I understand what you are saying about the medical movement and lack of sincerity. However, some are sincere, and those who are should not be punished because of those who aren't as the feds would like us to believe that all use is recreational, no matter what a doctor may think.

You are absolutely correct, in a world where people can be dishonest by choice, it is virtually impossible to gauge sincerity, and I agree that there should be some historical or scriptural backing for ones claims of sacramental use.

I'm not sure quite how your friends claims to the throne equate to my sincere belief that cannabis has helped me greatly in my quest for spiritual understanding. They seem like two different claims to me. If your friend thought that apples helped him in his spiritual quest, or if I had a psychological disorder and thought I had been elected president, I could see your point, but it seems like we are talking about two different things here.

Your last point is one I have dealt with before. I have had it pointed out that certain religious people feel that it is their belief that it is okay to have sex with their children, and this has come at me from two totally different angles, so I can only assume that there are people who believe this. Two things that come to mind, one where is that historical or scriptural evidence that any God would wish for you to do such a thing to a child, I can think of half a dozen references by Jesus that state to harm a child is really bad... Also, there is something about having sex with a child that doesn't equate to me smoking cannabis, can you think of what that might be?

Your example is along the same lines, and there is one element between the two that doesn't add up, the third example comes from an article in Hawaii where someone stated that if one can make cannabis legal by professing a religion based on it, then one could as easily create a religion where they don't have to obey the stop sign laws and get away with it, and once again, there is this level of harm associated with all three examples, not to mention no scriptural or historical basis for such a belief.

What I really don't get is why people tend to associate my argument with an argument where someone is harmed by the given example while my consumption of cannabis harms no one, arguably not even myself, and if it does harm me, that is my choice.

I stand by the sentiment that The government shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion or the free exercise thereof. It is the first part of the first amendment, and the founding fathers felt it was most important.

My only expansion on that is that no religion should inflict any harm in its practice. As long as what you believe harms none, then I honestly do not care what you believe. It is your right to believe what you want, it is not your right to bring harm to another.

Peace and Love

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Brother Logos
The more I learn, the less I know. | Truth doesn't change, only our perception of it does.
THC Ministry | The Aquarian Gospel of Jesus the Christ | The Reluctant Messenger of Science and Religion
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Buzzby

To use multiquote, hit that button for all posts you want to quote except the last. On that one, hit the regular quote button. The other bug is there, but since it requires no more than another click to get around - not a major problem.

The US government doesn't buy the Rastas' claim. That's only my take.

Since it hasn't been part of Christian practice in a couple of millennia, I doubt it.

Did that ruling ever get challenged up to the USSC? I hadn't heard that Rastafarians had the exemption.

You stated that people with a sincere belief in something ought to be granted special privileges because of that belief. My friend sincerely believes that he is the rightful King of England.

The government tells us that the reason we're not allowed to use marijuana is because it is harmful to us. The government doesn't accept your thesis that what one puts in his own body is nobody's business but his own.

I agree, but I recognize that there is a gray area between free practice of religion and having the privilege to ignore the law.

Groups that advocate sex with children claim that it is for the children's benefit. Who gets to determine "harm" or "benefit"? The same applies to the use of marijuana.

Logos

Excellent Buzzby!

Your responses leave me with no further questions.

I only know of one 9th circuit court ruling allowing Rastafarian's use of cannabis as sacrament, and it was somewhere in the vicinity of 7 years ago that I read about it. I have done searches since to find the info again, but have failed to locate it. I have never been great at searching out info for some reason.

Must be why they hated Peter McWilliams so much. A book titled "Nobody's Business If I Do" was just too much for them to tolerate.

Heh, While I agree that this is their attitude, I presume that you would agree that they are overstepping their authority. Not to mention if they are so concerned about harmful things which we take in then they should at least be consistent about it. They should add the following items to the schedule 1 list. alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, sugar, chocolate, fast food, and television...

Of course if they outlawed alcohol and nicotine, the government would go broke in about ten minutes.

I'm shooting for amusing more than serious at this point if that isn't obvious...

Thanks for the clarifications.

Peace and Love