InfectedWithMJ

There are only 13 states where MJ is somewhat decriminalized and has some medical use allowances. If the federal government removes penalties for possession then it does not necessarily mean all the states or most of the states or even any states will drop those charges. Or am I missing something here? 13 States made it somewhat legal even though the feds did not allow it. So, if the other 37 states really wanted to decriminalize it - they would have done it regardless of federal laws. I have big doubts that changing federal laws will directly affect state laws...

As far as medical use goes - many states want recommendation only for seriously ill patients. Sure, there are those compassionate doctors, but the states or the feds can have very strict guide-lines.

All-in-all, it all feels like your average stoner Joe in those 37 states will still have issues with the law.

The last question is this - what makes people think that the government won't simply increase the measures when it comes down to the war on drugs? If you're losing a battle with current penalties then maybe increasing punishment harsheness will help things! They could make you go to jail for 25 years for a 1g of weed. Or maybe they could find some OTHER measures to fight the war that will keep bud illegal as it is.

Some say such harsh measures can create a rebellion like during alcohol prohibition. Thing is... there are more alcohol drinkers and its far more accepted and used than marijuana. In addition, the government has way more control over people and they can put down just any rebellion.

nornerator

I have a feeling that states would be more willing to pass decriminalization measures if they did so with the blessing of the federal government.

Its a tribute to our strength and dedication that we (cannabis consumers) were able to get state politicians to spend time passing legislation decriminalizing use, in spite of the 2004 Supreme Court Ruling that basically says federal law always trumps state law.

I don't think EVERYONE in the government wants it illegal. I think most people in law enforcement, prison industry, pharmaceutical industry, and alcohol/tobacco industries want to keep it illegal.

The Cannabis Consumers will win this war. We have the facts on our side, and eventually, the truth will set us free. Either that, or nuclear annihilation will occur before legalization.

InfectedWithMJ

Have you heard of feds going into MJ friendly states to bust average joe users? They bust dispensaries, growers, dealers, traffickers. They wouldn't go to bust simple possessors. That means that states, even now, have the power to decriminalize small amounts and that WOULD keep simple possessors out of prisons. Thing is - its not happening because the state government don't want it legalized. Some do and they already have it. Its not like one state has more power than the other in the eyes of the feds.

Besides, do you really think consumers can win over law enforcement, pharmaceuticals, and alcohol/tobacco producers? A stoner's image is a loser in a hoodie (even though its not true), while those other guys have the image of successful responsible citizens.

nornerator

The federal decriminalization will not help the average toker, you are right.

If the feds simply stepped away from the table and said "we don't care about cannabis anymore, the states can decide to enforce prohibition or not" I think we would see some states legalize it rather quickly.

For instance, legalizing medical marijuana has been going at a decent pace for the past 13 years. Now that the federal government said that the states can decide on medical marijuana (as per eric holders comments earlier this year) we see many states pushing forward legislation to legalize medical marijuana.

We aren't going to see marijuana legalized this year, but we will see it legalized in the next 5 years if we keep the pace we've been going at.

InfectedWithMJ

But if medical weed is heavily regulated then only very specific patients will get it and even compassionate doctors won't help (or else they will lose their license).

You have missed my last reply completely. 13 states already have it decriminalized without that federal ruling and allowance. Why? Why not others? I know why - others do not want to do it because they think it is wrong to do so. Like I said, feds would never go after simple possessors and that means just about any state can decriminalization possession, but they won't.

Its not going to happen within next 5 years for sure. In fact, in my personal opinion, a country such as the United States will never decriminalize it.

sterbo

I don't know where you get that idea.
Any number of States have instituted varying degrees of decriminalization, de facto or otherwise. Possession is commonly a mere slap on the wrist if even that. In Alaska possession of an ounce or less is legal.
It is a huge hurdle we have jumped in the last decade or so.
Absolutely, no question about it. Not anymore.
That's a caricature mired in the past. These days most people laugh at those images as a joke but nothing more. Far more common is a shrug of the shoulders and an even handed acknowledgment that cannabis use transcends all social strata with little or no adverse impact that the public (let alone government) should concern themselves with...

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Buzzby

That's not entirely true. There are 13 decriminalization states and 14 medical marijuana states. There are actually 20 states that are decriminalization, medical marijuana, or both states.



Many states have said that they would not move forward on reforming their marijuana laws until the federal government makes it possible for citizens to possess marijuana without breaking the law. 20 states just had more balls than the rest. State legislatures are generally not in the business of telling their citizens that it's OK to break federal laws.

Federal decriminalization will give the rest of the states a go-ahead to do what they want to do.

One step at a time. The major benefit for non-medical users of medical marijuana is that it creates an atmosphere where the "evilness" of marijuana is blown away by how much good it can do and by the fact that medical users don't instantly become unemployable hippies. Think of how a lot of our OTC drugs get to be that way. At first they were highly restricted prescription drugs. When it was learned that they could be safely used without all of the restrictions, the restrictions were removed.

Did you really think that passage of any federal law would change everything for everyone all at once? One step at a time...

It's been tried and failed. The public's attitude towards marijuana will not allow heavier restrictions to be imposed.

You took that seriously? No one else in Congress did. Talk about desperately swimming against the current!

Of course they could. They could nuke Pittsburgh, but it's not very likely. The majority of the country knows that the War on Weed is a complete failure and politicians don't like their constituents to think they're beating a dead horse with their money.

Are you referring to alcohol prohibition in the United States? There was no rebellion during alcohol prohibition. It was pretty much the same as marijuana prohibition, right to the end. People who wanted to drink continued to do so illegally. Criminals made fortunes and mostly killed other criminals. People ignored that stupid prohibition in much the same way we pay little attention to the laws against marijuana, except to try to avoid getting caught.

Thing is... Things change. Recreational marijuana is supported by more than 50% of the population and medical marijuana is supported by 75%. These figures have been rising steadily and continue to do so.

You know, don't you, that this whole rebellion thing is just in your head?

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InfectedWithMJ

I don't mean rebellion as in real revolution. I mean mass protest (peaceful) by refusing to obey the law.

I've mentioned this before but criminal records are becoming easier and easier to get a hold by companies these days. That puts more pressure on productive citizens to stop using weed or not even start it. In fact, criminal record is the biggest b*tch out of all consequences of using weed. Punishments are not that severe, not passing a drug test bans you from working for one company, but a criminal record f*cks you up forever.

I don't know where you got those 50% statistics... I saw that said 40% used it once, but I think its 10% or less of people who use marijuana frequently enough to consider them...users (potheads?). How many of them are criminals and losers who will be looked down upon? I'm sure a big chunk.

And back to states' rights. I may be overthinking this, but I remember that slavery was also a states' rights issue. Wouldn't allowing states to decriminalize be more of an issue of general states' rights than MJ reform? It could be a gate for states to argue for decriminalizing other substances and wanting more individual freedom that the feds don't want to give.

How do you know that states' saying "If the feds let us, we will" isn't just an excuse not to decriminalize because they know feds won't let them?
Those 14-20 states had balls as you said, but what the hell? How could feds regulate state simple possession? Limit state funds?

I just think politics of decriminalizing is bigger than the actual decriminalizing.