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GanjaSmoker

hell yea!

Legalize everything!

 

yamoothecow

[quote=yamoothecow] I would say like cigg, but because it does get you high I doupt if recreational use was legalized the goverement would give it to minors, nor would I[quote]
^^^^^
That's the way I meant to type it.

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"Make the most of the Indian hemp seed, and sow it everywhere!"
George Washington/Note to the gardener at Mount Vernon, 1794

runndex

I say if people use them in the privacy of there homes I agree 100%

^_^truth

100% legalization of all drugs: It does sound promising; however, I hate to say it, but some drugs don't have very benifical side-effects.

How about every Natural Drug. Now that I can agree with. At least then we know it was put on earth for something, and if it is not for human use, well we will soon figure that out after we legalize everything won't we.

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Insanity in individuals is something rare - but in groups, parties, nations and epochs, it is the rule.
Nietzsche

SacredNaCl

...And you aren't understanding JTP's arguement. He's for legalizing it, but he doesn't want to subsidize the cost, doesn't want to pay for "free" or "discount " treatment centers. Honestly, he shouldn't have to.

Methadone sells for .25 cents for 40mg at Walgreens. 40mg of methadone is a hell of a lot of methadone. A mere $80 would buy 12,800mg of methadone -- or enough to get every single person in my town of 4000 high. 15 grams of morphine sells for $19.94 at Walgreens. Now the morphine is inflated, but not out of reach. For less than the cost of a carton of cigarettes (even at marked up pharmacy prices) a heroin addict could have 214mg a day of morphine for an entire week (less than $20 a week)-- which is a $200 a day (or more) habit on the street.

Under a legalized system without the expensive RX controls in place & other markup (for insurance reasons) in place it would be less than half of that. I think a junkie can afford $10 a week. Synthetics can be produced even cheaper (as in the case of methadone), china white and other fentanyl derivitives can be produced for less than a penny per hit severely potent enough to sate any junkie with a $2,000 a week illegal market price habit.

Even under full legalization, opioid addicts would have a hard time. No, not from being impaired, but because opioid abuse is self limiting. You can only get high for so long till the doses get so massive that the side effects stop even junkies from using more. They would have to taper off and quit for awhile to be able to get high again. But even if they didn't take breaks, even a 1000mg a day morphine habit would be less than $8 a day, most methadone clinics charge between $15 and $20 a day for far less. This isn't the type of money that is unobtainable even at a minimum wage job. I know people (poor suckers that think NYC or California is a great place to live) that are paying almost $8 a day for a pack of cigarettes. Of course they are paying that because of another type of parasite (government). I know people that blow that much on Starbucks filthy awful coffee every morning.

You can buy this stuff wholesale far cheaper. Mallinckrodt makes synthetic cocaine for medical use for around $160 a kilogram. That's a lot of cocaine my friend, enough to get everyone in my town of 4000 high, well, at least the ones without a current habit anyway.

Synthetic oxycodone isn't much more than that. So even if they had a preference for that, it wouldn't matter. It could still easily be accomodated by the chemical suppliers at very affordable prices.

Simply put, we aren't subsidizing programs to actually help people quit smoking. Propaganda campaigns to quit don't count. They don't buy nicotine patches, gum, wellbutrin, nicotine inhalers...etc for people wanting to quit, or pay for conseling programs free of charge to help people quit. Nicotine is far more addictive than heroin, maybe even as addictive as methadone but that is a hard call. If people choose a habit and want to quit, that is their own business and own problem. If they choose a habit, they choose to support it themselves, just like tobacco smokers overwhelmingly do. No one is out handing out packs of cigarettes to smokers every day for free. That is their own problem too. Addicts pay for methadone maintainence out of their own pocket in just about every clinic across the nation. The only exception to this is a few states pay for suboxone treatment through medicaid, but that is the exception and not the rule.


...And if they still choose to steal to get the few pennies it cost to support their habit, well, then that becomes our problem, but we shouldn't have to pay their cost while they are in prison, eh? Even a *prison job* at $.37 an hour pays enough to be able to afford fentanyl derivitives. We don't buy prisoners cigarettes, they buy them for themselves, why should this be any different? Not that I think the prisons would let them have it, they don't let them have booze.

...and BTW, most methadone treatment facilities are for profit and recieve $0 in subsidy. They actually turn a profit, of course it would be hard not to selling .50 to .75 worth of methadone for $15 a pop... That is a whole other racket I would love to see come an end, not because it isn't better than the present illegal market alternative, but because they have no incentive to get people off of methadone, and many of them treat their clients very poorly and make it difficult for them to be able to work regular jobs by having to show up every day during the time they would need to be at work and wait around for hours and hours. That is very dehumanizing and demeaning. Legalize it and they could go to walgreens and buy an entire months supply for less than $45 and be able to live their life without someone else pulling their string extracting the cost of nearly a house payment every month out of them.

It's the people who don't believe in the free market who have a problem with letting the market take care of it. They want to set up gatekeepers, and taxpayer subsidy, and free heroin and yadda yadda yadda. The market can deal with this, these products aren't so damn special that they require gatekeepers at every turn. The only government needed here is a law that says you put a label on it saying what it contains, a basic standard for purity, and enforce that it does contain what it says it does. No different from gasoline, aspirin, and coca cola. The chemistry that goes into making your cardboard processed microwave dinner is far more complex than the chemistry involved in making most of these drugs. If they can regulate a "flavor enhancer" and sell it on the open market, we can clearly handle this.

 

JTP

That ^ is a bad*** reply.

jabmf316

I had a childhood buddy of mine OD from "hard drugs", and although making that stuff legal sounds dumb, maybe he'ld still be here today if he could have went to a safe controlled part of town away from everyone, and had he been given a pure medically approved dose, he might still be alive. It's sad because he was such a fun person that put a smile on everyone's face he met. Also it seems painfully obvious (for me anyway) that when something is illegal, it only creates crime. If the government really wanted to stop crime, they could controll drugs legally and safely, and put the gangs out of business. Give people who use drugs a liscense to use, and help monitor them. When people hide, you cannot help them. When you know who and where the users are, you can help. Does this make sense? Drugs are a medical issue not a criminal issue. Unless you commit a crime on drugs.

Buzzby

A crime is a crime is a crime. Committing one under the influence of a drug changes nothing. It neither excuses the crime nor does it make the crime any worse. Drugs are strictly a medical issue - unless the crime involves illegally supplying drugs to an unqualified person or forcing them on someone against their will.

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jabmf316

Buzzby says,
Yes of course, but let "WE THE PEOPLE" and physicians (they count too i guess) decide this fate. Not Law Enforcement.
At least by todays standards anyway.
If I had my way, coffee shops, compassion clubs and pharmacies would only despense high quality herb. All labelled thuroughly so one knows what one's injesting. Designated herb smoking areas only in public, out of others eye. Like back of or inside a cafe - Don't wanna disrespect those who choose not to partake. 100% legal in privacy of home. A dozen plant limit. No unauthorized selling or buying without a special lisense. If you exceed or break these guidelines, you get a BIG fat fine and no jail time at all unless you get caught giving or selling to minors. A quarter or half oz. limit okay to have discretely on one's possession in public, and to purchase at coffee shops. Maybe a pound limit if found at ones home. If anyone under 18 years old get caught possessing any amount then they and mom and pop get a fine, and some counseling. No jail, no uneccasary records, no loss of life, limb or property, and surely not a loss for one pursuit for happiness!