m.t.ness

"The chief difference between cannabis and every other drug is that every other drug can be consumed to a toxic and lethal amount. "

i know . but why should that prevent us from legalizing the others? alcohol can kill you . should we make it illegal?



" There always has been, there proabably always will be becasue that is the nature of the human animal. "


if you leave recreational use illegal it will be. but do you know of a black market for alcohol that exists in america today? i dont. if you do tell me about it. if there is one its not big enough to result in gang fighting.

"No one goes out one day and says I want to be a junky. It happens. "

they chose to use the drug. thats the same as saying i will take the consequence of this use.

"As for forcing someone to go through treatment not being something we should do in a free country, that person has given up certain liberties by doing an action that has gotten them arrested. A "non-violent" action but one that has drawn the attention of to themselves that they or another is/might become risk. "

"That is the same cause for involuntary admittance for psychiatric evaluation. Sounds like mandatory treatment is the humane manner in which to handle a human experiencing an addicition or drug induced psychosis."


if they refuse to go through treatment what are you going to do to them? put them in jail? thats where we already are. we are locking people up for their personal lifestyle choices. i dont think that that is working

dedbr

but I don't believe it.Only legalize herb?Leave other drugs illegal because of toxicity?
I can overdose on aspirins,yet I can buy as many of those as I want;same with alcohol or anti- freeze for the car or a thousand other substances.There are things being sold right now that you can get an incredible buzz on,and the government considers that all right.To pick any one particular substance and say it's worse than all the rest in the world is rediculous.It is simply in the way I use it.Period,end of story.
No,I don't want my kids sucking up any anti- freeze or heroin,but if I don't teach them well,there is a very good chance that they will.I am in charge of the raising of my own kids.If I don't do it right,then I only have myself to blame for their destuctive behavior,and their failure in society.
To many laws seek to assume responsibility for the actions of citizens,as if we can not be trusted to control our baser instincts,whether they be sexual or substances that they seem to think we as individuals can't handle.I have even heard a lot here lately about how it is wrong morally to use drugs.Now my morals are being dragged back into it.If it's going to be about religious laws,we are truly doomed.
Treatment is being touted as the answer to our supposed drug problem.Mama quoted a figure of perhaps 10,000 dollars for a minimum care rehab facility.Let me get treatment out of the way by saying this;1 in 37 people who get sober stay that way for one year folks.One person.So,figure it out for yourself.We as citizens,will have to pay for rehab for 37 people($370,000) for one person to get sober.Boy,lets throw more money away on a solution that simply doesn't work.Brilliant idea.There are people who go thru rehab any number of times and never stay sober.Do we keep wasting money on them,even though we know it's not going to work?
So,whats the solution?Simple.Prohibition is a failure.That means it's a failure in any way,shape or form.Now we see that treatment is just a big money machine that is so self serving as to be rediculous.But dedbr,you say,I don't want my kids smoking crack,what about that?I don't want mine smoking crack either,but I will do my best to teach them how wrong that is,just like I won't let them drink anti-freeze.
The war on substances and citizens began when they said we are not smart enough or religious enough to suit some body else.We are little children,not responsible enough to be trusted with certain things,so we will arrest you and make an example out of you for the rest of your kind.
I want the money they spend on the drug war and treatment to go to the schools and raise generation after generation of brilliant children.Ones smart enough to know that you won't have much of a life if you sit around stoned all the time.It doesn't really matter what your stoned on,abuse is abuse,and you know you're doing it if you are.

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suede

Which is what I try to do !So,with that said;
I am the 1/37% who stayed sober ,not for 1 year,but for 2 1/2 years now.Yes I am bragging My support group would disagree........Sobriety means just was it implies. I think that means No artificial alterations to the consciousness.??Anyway I needed rehab.........My choice......I don't need rehab for my marijuana use......I am a responsible adult in the eyes of those who know me,and that's all that matters to me.It's also all that should matter to the society to which I contributeB.suede


Pass me that plate of cookies please

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m.t.ness

dedbr seems to be saying that if a person is sober for a year and then falls back into drug use that rehab is a failure . i would disagree because even though they fall off the wagon that doesnt mean that they cant get back on it again. the mental dependence that they have on the drug is something that they will struggle with for the rest of their lives. just because they fall somtimes doesnt mean that rehab is a failure. rehab might not be perfect but its the best solution to the problem of addiction that we have. if something better comes along we should recommend it . until then, rehab is better than prison. lets take one problem at time dedbr. the first problem we have is the fact that our government wants to treat drug addiction as a criminal act. first we have to get the behavior out of that category. wehavent done that yet. then we candeal with the inadequecies of drug treatment.
the only ting i objected to was the idea of forced treatment. the term forced infers the threat of jail and it is contrary to this countries ideas of freedom.

TheCleric

I personally think there is a large scale difference between marijuana and other drugs. And i in no way advocate legalization for all drugs. Then again im also the type of guy that thinks alcohol should be done away with and that you should be carded to buy over the counter medicine that can kill you if you overdose on it.

Am i right? No. Am i wrong? No. Im opinionated, and IMHO not too many people can handle the effects of harder drugs. Not to mention the cost of such things, which is a lot more than a bag of weed that will last you a couple of weeks. If a person decides to try a certain drug they may want to keep doing it but not have the money to support their habit, then what? Where a stoner would go get a job or simply go without we cant really say what a hard drug user would do.

When marijuana is legal i will switch my fight over to keeping harder drugs illegal. Because thats what i feel is the right thing to do.

The major difference between marijuana and harder drugs, do you see a legalization movement for heroin or cocaine? I didnt think so. Hard drug users know they dont have a real reason for them to be legal so they dont even try.

Cleric

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koah_nicole

i think that it would be definately stupid for them to legaize all drugs. MYself, i definately think that they should legalize marijuana because it isnt a drug it is an HERB!!!



Koah

JackStraw

While the chance for legalizing Marijuana anytime soon is pretty slim, the chance of legalizing all drugs is pretty much zero. If there is this much disagreemnt in a group that consists mainly of current marijuana smokers, imagine how many non-drug users would be against legalizing all drugs.

I think it is important for the Marijuana legalization movement to seperate itself from the overall drug legalization movement. Many of our best points for marijuana legalization (natrually growing, similar to alcohol and tobacco, non-lethal) do not apply to harder drugs. We need to focus our message into "Legalize Marijuana" and away from Legalize drugs. We would be hard pressed to find a mainstream voter who is in favor of legalizing heroin, meth or cocaine, but might find some sympathy for Marijuana.

But from a political standpoint, I believe all drugs should be legal, with marijuana openly available in a market like alcohol or tobacco, with most other drugs being closely regulated.

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schwadood

The thing on this issue is that you'd be kind of hypocritical to say that you can so this but you can't do that. If a person really wants to throw his life away shooting up, who are we to stop him? I realize how some people are gonna think that this is some how immoral, but really, you wouldn't be able to stop them if you tried. I also don't see how using a substance can be an arrestable offense. I would be in favor of treatment programs for "addicts" as opposed to jail time. But you run into some obstacles there because what exactly qualifies as an addict? What dedbr said about the inefficiancy of rehab would also be a problem, but if the money for the war on drugs was diverted into treatment programs I'm sure there would be enough. Hopefully more people would be educated about the difference between use and abuse and recovering addicts can have better support once they leave rehab.

While I do see that hard drugs are extremely dangerous I don't think keeping them illegal will be the answer, even if mj does get lagalized. I might be wrong, maybe once weed is legal people will realize that they don't really want much else. We might just have to wait and see.

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suede

I understand it possibly being missed I think that even the concept of legalizing all drugs is not in keeping with the tradition of this site.discussion has already brought up other drugs and I am guilty of not refraining.Rehabilitation seemd to end up the focus,so I'll just pose a question and we all can ignore it or sit around and b.s.

sorry m.t.ness,i didn't get that from dedbr's post @ all.


the question;
Duh U need 2 B rehabilitated for smoking marijuana?

Conine

argh

Well, I typed a LOVELY long post, claiming that marijuana rehab was pointless and I wanted to hear from someone who thought it was useful.

But, since I'm a fuggin stoner, somehow I got lost on the way to posting it. So this is all you get. I say MJ rehab is pointless because it isn't physically addictive.