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Old 11-19-2006, 04:48 AM   #11
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What is the goal of evolution anyways? To have evolved so many times that you dont need to evolve anymore? If that is true, it seems to me that it would be better to have never evolved at all. So does that make our existance merely a product of power and the desire for more?
The purpose of evolution is to survive. As a being's environment changes, the being needs to adapt to survive, and this is what we call evolution. As long as there are changes in environment, changes in energy, (what we perceive as time) everything will need to continue to evolve and adapt to survive. There will never be an 'end' to evolution, unless there is an 'end' to time.
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Old 11-24-2006, 05:35 AM   #12
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Let's not think so small as to limit evolution to the earth only also. Why did evolution begin here? Well because it goes on everywhere naturally. The universe evolves, the galaxies within it evolve, the stars within galaxies evolve, the planets that surround them evolve to sometimes support evolutionary steps that lead to life ... which evolves. See how the evolution of life on a planet is a very small (albeit amazing) happening of the constant evolution of the universe itself.
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Old 11-28-2006, 05:02 AM   #13
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The 2nd law of thermodynamics: the longer a system exists, the more chaotic it becomes.

Evolution is just that I believe. Creating more and more variations of life, therefore becoming more chaotic.
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Old 12-12-2006, 11:14 PM   #14
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It's hilarious how so many people blindly believe in evolution, yet they have no understanding of how it allegedly works.

According to the hypothesis, the single cells MUTATED. A multi-cellular organism was originally a fluke of nature. Nature makes a lot of these mistakes, according to evolutionary scientists. And some of these mistakes actually turn out to be advantages!

Of course, we have no evidence of a mutation being beneficial to a species. But evolutionists have reached a "consensus" that this is what had to have happened. And, nowadays, scientific consensus means more to people than actual scientific results.

So yeah, somewhere along the line, a single-celled organism allegedly gave birth to a multi-cellular organism by MISTAKE.
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Old 06-25-2007, 01:14 PM   #15
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data, I would not say the the universe is far from settled without knowing if it can be stirred up
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Old 06-26-2007, 12:07 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by silverspork View Post
The 2nd law of thermodynamics: the longer a system exists, the more chaotic it becomes.

Evolution is just that I believe. Creating more and more variations of life, therefore becoming more chaotic.
Entropy is in part a measure of the amount of disorder, and you could say chaos in a system. But it also takes into regard that the more chaotic the system naturally becomes, the less available energy there is to do work.

Complete disorder would in turn create a perfect and neutral order.

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It's hilarious how so many people blindly believe in evolution, yet they have no understanding of how it allegedly works.

According to the hypothesis, the single cells MUTATED. A multi-cellular organism was originally a fluke of nature. Nature makes a lot of these mistakes, according to evolutionary scientists. And some of these mistakes actually turn out to be advantages!

Of course, we have no evidence of a mutation being beneficial to a species. But evolutionists have reached a "consensus" that this is what had to have happened. And, nowadays, scientific consensus means more to people than actual scientific results.

So yeah, somewhere along the line, a single-celled organism allegedly gave birth to a multi-cellular organism by MISTAKE.
Yes, it is hilarious.
All evolution is either random changes in genetic material, or natural selection of the positive random changes. Mutations that are beneficial get passed on, while mutations that are not die out. The weak lizards with thin skin get roasted in the sun, while the thick skinned lizards live to reproduce and pass on their DNA.
There is only one species I know of that willingly pursues a path through evolution against natural selection. It will suffer because of it though.

What's more intriguing to me than the first multi-cellular organize, is the first single celled organism. What bonded those atoms, elements, and substances in such a way that one day, consciousness was formed.
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Old 06-26-2007, 12:43 AM   #17
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Lets ask god...
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Old 06-26-2007, 12:55 AM   #18
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Lets ask god...
Which one?
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Old 06-26-2007, 06:31 PM   #19
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Why did the first organisms on Earth need to evolve?
Life has a Prime Directive: Keep Living! This largely relates to the survival of species. The survival of individuals is secondary. The survival of a species is tied to adaptation to its environment and the capability to compete for resources with other species. Plant-like single celled organisms developed first. Some mutated and found that their survival was enhanced by eating their brethren, i.e. stealing the energy stored by their photosynthesis. It went on from there, with random mutations that proved survival-positive, making new varieties more capable of getting the most out of their environments.

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Correct me if Im wrong, but arent single celled organisms like bacteria able to live in all kinds of extreme environments?
Some are, but that doesn't mean they can survive in all kinds of environments. They are specially adapted to live specifically in their own particular kind of harsh environment.

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If they are then it doesnt seem like they would have any need to adapt at all.
Different varieties were needed for each type of environment and then competition within each environment made further adaptations more successful.

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Couldn't they have just stayed the way they were and survived perfectly well?
Some did. Newer varieties spread to environments the originals couldn't handle and competition for food/space/energy lead to further change. As environments changed, some species were better adapted. They survived, prospered, and became dominant. Species that didn't adapt to the changes faded away.

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Does anyone see a connection to this question and the story of Adam and Eve from the Bible?
No. Nature is not a paradise from the viewpoint of species in competition with other species.

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What is the goal of evolution anyways?
Having a goal implies a conscious process. Evolution is simply the movement, over time, for species to adapt and excel in their changing environments.

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So does that make our existance merely a product of power and the desire for more?
No. That's merely the unconscious evolutionary part of our existence. As individuals we have much more complex lives and goals beyond being fruitful and multiplying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by silverspork
The 2nd law of thermodynamics: the longer a system exists, the more chaotic it becomes.

Evolution is just that I believe. Creating more and more variations of life, therefore becoming more chaotic.
Life is a temporary denial of entropy. A system becomes more chaotic over time unless there is energy added from outside the system to maintain or increase the level of organization. Entropy is a problem only in a closed system. The Earth's ecosphere is constantly receiving energy from the sun. When the sun no longer supplies that energy, entropy will gain the upper hand.

Having more species, far from being chaotic, creates a dynamically stable system that processes available energy and has the flexibility to adapt to changes in the environment.

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Originally Posted by Sikatriz
It's hilarious how so many people blindly believe in evolution, yet they have no understanding of how it allegedly works.
You appear to be one of them!

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Of course, we have no evidence of a mutation being beneficial to a species.
Sure we do. Tibetans can breath air that would be too thin for flatlanders to breath. People who evolved in tropical climates have dark skin to protect them from the harsh sun. People who evolved in cold climates have light skin so they can produce enough vitamin D from limited sun exposure. Hibernation is a very useful mutation if you live in an environment where there is little food available during a big chunk of the year. Any way in which a species has adapted to thrive in its environment is evidence of the benefits of mutation/evolution.

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So yeah, somewhere along the line, a single-celled organism allegedly gave birth to a multi-cellular organism by MISTAKE.
Single celled organisms mutated into working together to survive. We still see this today with species like slime molds. Single cells "give birth" by mitosis - dividing. Multi-cellular organisms evolved out of the cooperation of single celled organisms. The mitochondria that power our bodies' cells were originally a separate species and still have their own DNA.

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Originally Posted by Richi
Complete disorder would in turn create a perfect and neutral order.
Only if you consider a pile of sand to be a "perfect and neutral order". Order requires energy to maintain itself, otherwise entropy eventually destroys the order, leaving nothing behind capable of doing anything because it lacks the energy to do so. The ultimate product of entropy is an amorphous universe with no stars, an evenly dispersed cloud of amount of matter, and no energy to ever create order again.

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What's more intriguing to me than the first multi-cellular organize, is the first single celled organism. What bonded those atoms, elements, and substances in such a way that one day, consciousness was formed.
Cellular life wasn't the first life. Life started with self-replicating molecules similar to DNA, which were created in the random chemical interactions of the "primordial soup". These evolved into things like viruses, which eventually evolved into single celled organisms. I'm not sure that human-type consciousness is a long-term survival trait. We've only been around a short time on the evolutionary scale and it's looking like we may not be around much longer. As you said:
Quote:
There is only one species I know of that willingly pursues a path through evolution against natural selection. It will suffer because of it though.
The planet's ecosystem was much more stable before a species came along that destroyed most of the natural checks and balances on its own growth.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:18 AM   #20
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Only if you consider a pile of sand to be a "perfect and neutral order". The ultimate product of entropy is an amorphous universe with no stars, an evenly dispersed cloud of amount of matter, and no energy to ever create order again.
This is order, is it not? Great order with little energy, granted.


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Cellular life wasn't the first life. Life started with self-replicating molecules similar to DNA, which were created in the random chemical interactions of the "primordial soup". These evolved into things like viruses, which eventually evolved into single celled organisms.
The first DNA strand then, what made it replicate itself, when the molecule before it didn't...

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We've only been around a short time on the evolutionary scale and it's looking like we may not be around much longer.
Quite a shame, quite a shame... we are such marvelous creatures!
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