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HappyMan

Now does anyone have a workable deffinition of a conservative?

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Captain Honkey

It's hard to say. Conservative means a lot of different things to different people.

To me it means personal freedom, but to the religious right I suppose it means something completely different.

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vivrantv

liberals are whacked. They want the government to regulate everything. They want to abolish capitalism because they think the "rich" and the "large corporations" are too greedy. Well excuse me mother fuc***, but if you want to have money in your pockets, go out and get a job. Everybody in this country has the same opportunities, and when liberals pander to lazy americans and give the "rich" a bad name it pisses me off. Rich people are rich because they worked for it, and they don't owe a god damn thing to people who live in housing projects on welfare, which us "rich" people are paying for. We pay taxes and fund government programs that everybody takes advantage of, but not everybody pays for (90% of taxes are payed by the wealthiest 5% of people). It's common sense, where is there any flawed logic in this? Liberals are communists. Look at the soviet union now. That is what liberals want for america, whether they know it or not.

Lawnmower

Rough Definitions:

Liberals believe that there should be tight control of business and the economy, but as little control as possible on the individual.

Conservatives believe that the economy should be let do what it likes ("laissez-faire economics"), but that there should be plenty of rules governing the individual.


As for me, I'm a liberal. As for you - well just bear in mind that while the Democratic Party might be considered liberal in the US, they wouldn't really be anywhere else...

I really believe that people should vote for third parties if they support them more than the main ones. Critics will say that this is throwing your vote away (Simpsons 1996 Halloween episode summed this up better than anyone else in the world. Anyone else remember that?), but personally I think that unless you vote for the party you really *want*, then, as Aldai Stephenson said, you'll get the government you deserve.

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Lawnmower

vivrantv

Yeah the simpsons are great in the way poke fun of ....EVERYTHING!

Critics say that voting for a third party is throwing your vote away. Well it is basically. The vast, vast majority of the population will vote either democrat or republican, that's just the fact of the matter. Your vote will be squandered if you don't realize that third party ideologies are too extreme for middle america and just won't win in an election. (this is for presidential elections, that is).

 

Shaman

At this point, it isn't even really about getting third parties ELECTED, it's about getting them recognized. With just 5% of the vote comes federal funding, being allowed into the debates... etc..etc...

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vivrantv

Third parties are usually so "extreme" in their views, that even with vast recognition, the average american would not vote for a third party. Although I may be mistaken, how do I know?

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Lawnmower

But that's my point, Vivrantv, with that attitude, nothing will ever change! I know this involves two very different outlooks here - pragmatism and idealism - but I go with the idealist stance all the way. A choice between Gore and Bush is no choice at all. Well, ok it is, but it wouldn't be if Bush weren't so unbelievably awful. If you say that there's no chance of the two-party system ever ending, then that's not a democracy you're living in - it's just a choice of dictators. Vote for the party you agree with, not who you think has a chance of winning.

These things can change - for example in Britain, they had two main parties, the Tories and the Whigs (I think?) and then suddenly the second party got annihilated and the Labour party came to the fore. Something which had been in place for well over 200 years came crashing down. It can happen, but only if people vote with their hearts, not their heads.

Peace

Shaman

WHAT Two party system? The republicrats are one and the same now. The "smaller government republicans" under Bush just created a whole huge big-government beurocracy with the Dept. of Homeland Security... Think Gore would have been ANY different? (except he MIGHT not have wanted to drill for oil in alaska?)

Captain Honkey

So what is someone who doesn't want control on business/economy or on the individual?