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nornerator

Ok, so somebody please tell me why or how they can believe in any sort of deity or deities.

How can you believe in something you have never heard, seen, or felt?

Lets say that you claim to have "sensed" God in some way, shape, or form. Are you saying that all of those who "sensed" God that believe in a different God are lying? Those people who give their lives to please their God, do you think that they honestly don't truely believe in their God?

And if you do believe they are true believers of their faith, and that they feel that they have truely felt God, how can you be sure your faith is correct and that theirs is wrong?

Everyone in every religion believes that their religion is the one and only truth (and if they don't they either don't belong to a religion, or don't really follow it)

How can there be so many different religions with devout followers who have all claimed to have seen God, yet each religion believes different things, and in each religion people truly believe they know the truth, and have unbreakable faith.

How can you be sure yours is right? Is there a test to know if you are following the right religion?


If there was a single truth that applies to everyone everywhere, then why do most people who follow religion believe in the same religion as their parents?

Why does the Christian God only appear to people of the Christian faith? If an intelligent God wanted more people to have faith, he would appear to those who weren't Christian.

Why does the Islamic God appear to Muslims and not Christians? How can two groups both claim to see the one and only truth, yet both "truths" are different. Each group believes in their God with as much heart and soul as any other group, how do you know you are in the right group?

Now the whole idea of having "faith" is the most damn stupid ideas I have ever heard my entire life. Even when I was 7 and started going to Church it seemed completely ass backwards to have "faith"

In every other part of our lives, in order to make decisions for ourselves we use judgement, which is based off of perception of the senses. If we are standing in the middle of the road and a semi truck is hurtling towards us, we don't sit there and have "faith" that it will pass through us without harm. We move out of the way because we know from experience that when two objects approach each other, they will collide, not pass right through each other.

When you go to the supermarket and you see "Super Man Juice" and it reads "Anyone who drinks Superman Juice will become superman, just have faith" do you have faith in the advertising?

Would you like the break system in your car to operate off of faith?

Previously I mentioned that if there were one truth, it would pervade the entire world, and not propagate from parent to offspring. Well the fact is, there is one truth that dominates everything. The only way to find that truth is through science.

Science is the only unbiased view through which a person can look at the world. Science measures what is there. Science calculates correlations between events, and formulates theories for how things work.

Science does not try to make data "fit" into theories. Science is not about destroying religion, science is about finding the truth, and on the way to the truth, science makes it very easy to discard religion because the data in the real world does not reflect the theories of religion at all.

If data doesn't fit into a theory, a new theory must be made so that all of our observations are accounted for by a theory. Science does not cling to ideas or beliefs like religion does.

Science and religion does not go together, science tries to explain reality and understands its limitations and inability to understand reality completely. Religion claims to understand reality completely and 100% but the data in the real world does not reflect the theory of reality explained by religion.

This is why there is no such thing as a Christian Scientist. You are either a Christian or a Scientist. Its an oxymoron. Christian scientists seek out any data that will fit the Christian theory of reality and dismiss any data that disagrees. Real science looks at ALL the data.

Can you imagine a world where everyone made decisions off of faith?

People would be jumping off buildings, having faith that they can fly. Lighting themselves on fire in faith that they will not burn.


Am I the only one who sees that religion is absolutely ridiculous? Religion makes no sense at all. There are thousands of religions, each claiming their God(s) are the true ones.

I love it when Christians make fun of Mormons because of their weird faith, I just laugh because to me its like one person with a make believe friend is making fun of another person because their make believe friend is different from theirs.

I used to be really into Christianity for a year or two. I would be at Church 3-4 days a week. But then I started becoming aware. How could I be so ignorant. How could I be so arrogant to believe that Christianity is right above all other beliefs? There are hundreds, maybe thousands of religions, and through each one, people have been "touched by a God" and truely claim that they have had a prophetic vision and it validates their religion. All religions believe this, yet they don't see the irony, that if someone else is so sure their religion is true, and they have the same type of evidence for their belief, then how can you really know which one is true, if any at all?

No religion accurately reflects reality. If there was a religion that did, they would call it science.

Science is the non-biased measurement and observation of the world as it is. Scientists don't try to make mythical claims based on no data. Scientists view the most current up to date data of how the world works, and then come up with many different theories to explain it. Scientists might think one theory is better than the others, but there is no clinging belief in true science. If all the scientists are pretty sure the big bang is how the universe started, but then they start recording data from a novel source and realize it is much different, true scientists won't cling to the theory and try to adjust it to fit the new data, true scientists will now use that most accurate data to create a new theory, a theory which more accurately describes the universe.

Science is the only thing that politicians should pay attention to when making most decisions. They should ask "How does science predict the affect of x decision over y decision on the masses"

And when it comes to morality religion should be as far away as possible.

Christians, and more specifically Catholics.... The Pope didn't mind forging "The Donations of Constantine" in order to acquire the land that Vatican city sits on. The head government of the Catholic Church sits on land that was acquired through forgery of a document. If the pope or the Church was any real moral authority they would apologize and give the land back, or purchase it from Italy at the price at which it would normally go for to make it right. Now, its not only that, but what about 7 crusades. Not only is the idea of a Crusade horrendous, but the Crusades slaughtered many people in the name of religion, and they were also horribly managed... if God was on their side they would have won... right? I mean Might makes Right doesn't it? (sarcasm) Child rape...

The Protestants are almost just as bad.

Now I'm not just bashing Christians, what about Islamic extremists, the ones that blow themselves up to kill others because they think they will get to heaven quicker... what a crock of shit.

Don't forget Judaisism, they have extremists too don't forget.

All other religions are just as detrimental I am just most familiar with Christianity, Islam, and Judaisim so I seem to pick on them more. Sometimes it seems like I pick on Christians most, and thats probably true, but that is not because they are worse than any other religion, I have just been exposed and know the most about Christianity.

The only sort of morality that should be brought into place should be

"Does said action hurt somebody directly or indirectly?" if the answer is no, then the action is not an immoral act.

The way to determine whether something would hurt someone is to use LOGIC and Science.

I feel so many people have lost touch with logic due to religion, it is sickening.


Now some of you may say that I am being arrogant for saying that all of your religions are wrong, some would argue that I am being just as arrogant as you saying that your religion is right and all others are wrong. This is simply an untrue statement. I will show you all why this is an untrue statement.

Each religion explains reality in a different way, let us equate reality to the boiling point of water. (In celsius) This is a simplified example to show logic (or lack of logic)

Jews think water boils at 75 degrees and anyone saying other wise is wrong
Christians think water boils at 89.777 degrees and anyone saying other wise is wrong
Muslims think water boils at 54.325 degrees and anyone saying other wise is wrong

Science has measured the boiling point of water to be 100 degrees Celsius. This is what we observe everyday in the real world. It is not arrogant or ignorant for me to say that I know the truth, and you are all wrong because we all know that the boiling point of water is 100.

This is exactly what religion does, it completely contradicts science even though science is the most accurate description of reality we have. Science is not, and might not ever be able to give us absolute truth because it is arrogant to think we as humans are even smart enough to understand absolute truth, but science is and always will be the most accurate description of truth and reality.

Now all that being said, 90% of the people who practice any given religion are great people. Most religions at their core are about peace and being kind to others. This is what most people follow or try to follow. There is nothing wrong with believing whatever the hell you want but do not ever contact your congressman or representative about a moral issue based on religion. NOT EVERYONE FOLLOWS YOUR RELIGION. Practice your religion or faith in peace, practice because you believe not because you are too scared to "not believe" NEVER TRY TO PUSH YOUR RELIGION ON OTHERS. Share your opinions, thats good, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But it doesn't even make sense to make laws based on religion. Anyone that believes in a particular religion will follow the rules and codes of the religion anyways, it makes no sense to punish those who do not follow your religion for not following your religious rules.

I suppose many of you believe I will be burning in Hell for being a Heretic. If there is a God, he/she/it would not punish individuals for using logic.



Sorry for this long post, but can anyone who thinks that they have a logical or rational mind explain to me the logic in any particular religion?

 

RoldGold27

I myself believe that there is something else.whether it be a god or another life or anything of that sort. I think that it all depends on what a persons values are and how they grow up. If you grow up being taught a faith you are probly less likely to question it. If you are raised without a strict belief of a faith then you may not believe in one or even anything. This does not really answer what the logic in any religion is but it seamed like a decent answer and it was what came to mind.In the long run i think it is deffinatly how you are raised

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homemadebubbler

I agree with you completely, but I'm going to stay out of it for the most part, because I think just like people shouldnt force religion on anyone, I shouldnt try to "force" atheism on them.

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Frojoe

Personally I agree with you, however, to follow your line of argument, how can you call something billions of people believe in ridiculous. Until we can find other answers to the questions that religion answers for people, I'm guessing just as much as they are.

SpiralArchitect

I'm not going to bother reading all of what you wrote. Sorry.

But I can understand your argument. How can people believe in something that isn't really there? It's called faith.

If God was a physical being, and their was solid substantial proving evidence that religion 'x' is true, it would take away the value and power of faith that it gives to people.

My family is Catholic. I am the black sheep. You cannot take away from religion just because of some of the problems it causes, or creates.

Religion gives people a sense of well-being, emotional and spiritual power, as well as the ability to believe in themselves. Religion is an amazing tool that can be used in everyday applications/life/events/situations. Religion is single handedly the most powerful influential power in the world (Positive or negative, you have to admit it does more good than bad), without it a lot of people in this world would be lost - sure, some may consider these people weak, but you know what - as long as you are using something positive in your life, to live a positive life - more power to you! Your negativity is only weakness.

I don't believe any religion. Personally I think trying to classify, dissect, and label religion is a shot in the dark. I believe the powers of this world are too powerful for simple mortal minds to understand. It's fine to choose a certain religion (guideline) to follow, I am sure that the higher powers in this world realize that without proving themselves people will convert to other religions. They know humans are confused little creatures.

You know what though? I don't think they would care. They are worshiping none the less, and most likely 'God' isn't picking and choosing - he knows who has a good soul and who doesn't...

edit// I read a bit more what you said and I wanted to comment on Science and religion.

Why is it people divide the two? Is it not possible that science is indeed the basis of human life, but this basis must have started from somewhere. The most basic structures of life had to come from somewhere, and that is something science will never find an answer to. It's like calculating infinity.
That is where the higher powers come in.

__________________
I embrace my desire to
feel the rhythm,
to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow
to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain,
to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human.

 

newcarcaviar

I also completely agree. It actually kind of reminded me of the "Church of the Fonz" Family Guy episode.

I think it takes a lot of balls to post such an extreme opinion like this, so rock on, Nonerator!

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nornerator

I also agree with you on the not forcing atheism on anyone.

I don't think any belief should be forced upon anyone.

I however DO think that people should question everything, the world around them, what they are taught and what they believe, and question it constantly. But I'm not going to push this on anyone either.

What I will push is that no religion makes rules or laws that govern people that don't necessarily follow their religion.

That rules and laws not be made in the name of religion but on utilitarianism. Laws should be made to provide the most people the most good, or the least people with the least harm.

Whatever you want to believe is fine by me, but don't tell your congressmen to make laws regarding your faith. Thats when you will see me making a big stink.

tekkenlaw

I don't believe in any supreme being, but I do believe that people should be free to worship what they want. Even if god doesn't exist, some people get comfort and meaning when they believe in a god.

nornerator

I agree with you except on the point that religion does more good than bad.

I think it would be really difficult to tell, but I would say the opposite, purely for the fact that it makes a person feel like they know something that they really don't. This creates ignorance. This is bad because people stop questioning, when people stop questioning, we stop learning, and as a civilization, we would collapse. Remember when religion dominated the world? that was called the Dark Ages. Do you recall what is was called when secularism got a foothold on the world? The Renaissance.

Also religion has caused millions of people to be slaughtered through warfare, and torture, and imprisonment. I would hardly say it does more harm than good, but an accurate measurement would be difficult to find so neither of us can definitively say.

Also, I still defend there is no place for religion in science.

A scientific mind would not accept that there is no way to know how the building blocks of life came about, a scientist would question and continually try to find answers.

Besides who says we need a God to create the universe? Doesn't it make more sense that the universe always was, rather than "God always was, then created the universe"

Why does the universe have to start off as nothing and turn into something why can't it just be a different stage of something?

nornerator

Just because billions of people believe in ridiculous things, doesn't make it not ridiculous, nor does it make us just as right as them because we don't know EVERYTHING.

Science doesn't have to have all the answers to make it more accurate than religion. Science is a commitment to understanding the truth about the nature of reality. Science does not, and may not ever give us "the big picture" but it will certainly be much closer than any sort of religion.

Religions are based off of a single person (or sometimes a handful of people) that experience a spiritual situation and try to make theories to explain it (just like scientists) The difference is there is no way to test most of the "theories" in religion, and the ones that you can test almost always turn out wrong (creationism, geocentric theory, etc).

Also, I'm not sure if other religions are like this or just Christianity, but there is an enormous volume of logical contradictions in the bible. Don't worry because the good little Christian knows that God is above logic

Once again, sorry to pick on xtians, but I am most familiar with that belief system.