Nugg

Well, here it goes. I'm new to the forum so I don't know if this has been discussed before or where it should go, but the issue is something I have been debating for a couple years. Disclaimer: nothing I say here is how I feel, just realistic thoughts that need some outside feedback.

I'm sure we all want to puff puff pass without the fear of incarceration, getting our kids taken, or hefty fines. When our buddies come over and need a little help, we would like to help them without the thought of OMG I committed a felony carrying a year.

So I guess it all comes down to this. If weed was legal, what would happen to the economy. A lot of pro heads would say the economy would increase due to the fact that a business could grow and distribute, taxes would be paid, jobs would be created, new rehab clinics/support therapy groups would open, more pipe sales, and overall more dollars generated and more taxes paid. This is true.

But then, what happens to the poor? The ones who depend on selling a few z's a week to pay rent and feed their kids, what do they do? Literally millions of poor-middle class families would be out of "work". Laid off with no unemployment. What, in all reality, would then happen to the crime rate if they had to turn to selling other black market remedies? Because as we know, most poor folks dont start businesses, they work for mid-upper class people who did. So if the herb was legal, they would be still working min wage jobs, and not being able to rely on the extra income.

If the herb was legal to the point where poorer families that depend on the extra income could not compete or even have a chance to sell it due to a flooded market, would enough jobs be created to compensate this? Or would, on the other hand, the price drop low enough (lets say from $20 a g to $5 a g) that poor people would have actually have more money since they would not be spending as much a week on herb? As we can see in CA, this is not the case. Herb prices are the same at the meds as the street.

I guess in reality, it would depend on how legal it was - decriminalization vs medical vs full blown (legal/illegal as alcohol). That would ultimatly depend on how it would effect the economy.

That is enough for now. I would like this to be a discussion about the title of this thread - Weed, the Economy, and Poor People - and really not "ah man weed should be legal". I like to think on an economic stand point similar to a democrat, starting from the bottom and fixing it from the ground up, as opposed to from the top down.

So what do you think???
What is best for the economy and not just our right that herb should be legal???

GanjaLover

Well the poor current herb growers could start their own marijuana farms since they know how to grow, and then could maybe even make more money that way, not having to worry about the feds or anyone, and could grow a much larger crop.

FunkySkunky

Here is my two cents.

Scenario 1: Cannabis is decriminalized for simple possession only. In this case, the situation viewed macrocosmically would be virtually the same as the present, though the microcosmic view would change. For the user this would mean freedom to use, but not to buy/sell/cultivate. Let's assume this is virtually the same scenario as full illegality, since all of us disregard laws against use anyway.

Scenario 2: Cultivation and use becomes legal. This means anyone may cultivate for personal use. This scenario eliminates the need for the "middle man". The danger or unpredictability in the cannabis buy/sell market becomes almost invisible. Anyone can create and smoke their own stash. End of story.

Scenario 3: Cultivation, use and sale is legalized. In this scenario the layman becomes the entrepreneur; the user becomes the norm. Anyone may use, cultivate and sell their cannabis. In this scenario, the powers that be lose control of the system. (See Scenario 4).

Scenario 4: Cultivation, use and sale is legalized and/or nationalized: In this case, the government will subsidize and nationalize the cannabis industry. In this reality, hemp may be utilized for combustible oils, clothing and textiles and many other applications. This could prove to be a multi-billion dollar industry; a more efficient and renewable combustible fuel, strong fibers for clothing and textiles. This could be an economic solution. I like this option alot (IN THE RIGHT HANDS, that is). This option is vulnerable to corruption, as is any other nationalized industry.

There are many ways that we can win. Any of them is desirable, but only one of them is correct. My personally correct solution is Scenario 2. In this case, each user cultivates his own stash and smokes his own stash, no questions asked. That would be nice.

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GanjaLover

I highly agree with skunky.. as long as we didn't sell and kept everything to ourselves, then it would work (2nd scenario)

TwoGreenOneRed

I have had this same discussion with my cousin. He said that even though he loves weed, he is glad it is illegal because without prohibition many of his boys would not be able to pay the rent. The sad reality is that many poor people don't have many opportunities, and selling weed quickly becomes an enticing way to make more money than they ever could legally.

With that said, I strongly believe that we cannot allow our poor to have to rely on "crime" (if you consider an adult selling weed to another fully willing adult a crime) to pay the bills. We need to legalize it and give the poor more opportunities to move up the social ladder through an enhanced educational system, and a progressive tax system that benefits those at the very bottom in a way that they receive at least all the basics of a first world country.

I don't know how related this is, but for anybody interested in the widening gap between rich and poor in the USA over the last 40-50 years should read Paul Krugman's new book, "The Conscience of a Liberal". I finished it the other day and it was very informative. BTW he is one of The New York Times' most read columnists and just won (I believe) the Nobel prize for economics.

Nugg

Yea that is the sad reality - many poor people do rely on this so called "crime" to pay rent and feed their kids. Some of the dealers I know do it full time, some have medical/physical conditions that prevent them from working, while others have a crappy job - with dealing and their crappy job they make a decent salary and they have rent/food for the kids.

While I agree with GanjaLover that the poor could do that, just like in other business (I am a poor entrepreneur) those with more money in competition can do more and push the poor owners out. The poor and experienced growers would probably end up working for business man who himself probably could not grow, but had the money/equipment/space to setup (sort of like the current situation).

I have read some reports were the herb growing industry brings in 35 billion a year to growers. That is a lot of money for the economy and it does not include the lights, nutrients, pipes, papers, and everything else that goes with the industry. If we did say 35B, that would equate to almost 2.4 billion in sales taxes @ 6.75%, but it would probably be taxed higher like tobacco and alcohol, bringing in more money. I hate taxes/govt as much as anyone else but in the situation we (usa) are in, we need the tax dollars quick or our money isnt going to be worth anything - but that is another subject entirely!

Well, there I go rambling again. I just really think that we need a solution in this country about both the herb laws and the economy. I dont know the right solution. But I do know that if done correctly, something could work